Roger Woodbury’s Response and My Reply
Hi everyone! Below is what Roger wrote (in bold) on Elance as a new bid, nonetheless, after I sent him a link to read my response. I will also include my comments to him here.
Dear Tiffany: Thank you for reading my comments and for your rapid response. It is quite rare on these writing-for-hire sites that an employer responds so quickly. Many employers do not respond for weeks after the bid process closes, so your response was refreshing.
I’m so glad it met with your approval. I’m absolutely SHOCKED that more clients don’t respond to your extreme wisdom.
I am sincerely sorry your feelings were hurt. My intention was to get a response that would be focussed on what your intentions were and what you really wanted to do. It is not easy to write and attempt to publish anything, and I well understand how you must be frightened after reading the volumes of comments on your blog. If writing were as easy as blogging zippy one liners I doubt you would have posted a request for proposal at all.
That’s just it – I’m NOT frightened anymore at all. But I was in the past – and it was because of snobs like you. When I first read the above paragraph, I thought I was actually going to feel like a sincere apology had been given (I was unaware you didn’t know the meaning of the word), that maybe your attempt at being cute and cunning was just an accidental fail. Unfortunately, I read the rest of your reply.
Now all of that aside, you never did answer any of the questions that I asked. I did not ask them of you to “knock you down”, but to confirm for whom I might be writing. I assumed you were a very young person, and that much is now clear.
No you didn’t. You don’t ask someone how much time they spend on Facebook to get specs for the client unless it was a plot twist – you did it to sound superior, to let me know that you slave away at your craft instead of spending time on social networking (nice MySpace page by the way). Nice additional jab about immaturity. I’d much rather be young at heart and full of possibilities than a shrivel-hearted, bitter man like you.
Your RFP stated in the second sentence that you “want to try something the way James Patterson tries it – outsource a draft of a fction story to a ghostwriter….” Now, that isn’t really writing is it? Truthfully, don’t you think outsourcing creativity and than laying claim to authorship is, well, something else again? You also claim to “hate thieves of words”, yet you want to be the chief architect of the heist?
Actually I said I wanted to outsource a 10 page story. And then I was going to take the starting point and turn it into a novel, so yes, Roger Snootybury, it is writing. But not to someone of such “high caliber” as you, oh no! A thief of words doesn’t pay for those words, now do they? No, they steal them. I would think as a prolific writer, even YOU would know the difference in that. Why do you bother having a profile as a freelance GHOSTWRITER when it irks you so bad that someone may actually want a freelance ghostwriter to do the job, get paid, and that’s it? Were you confused by the term? Do we need to educate you on what ghostwriting entails?
You know, your blog comments show you know how to write in at least the chatroom. I’ll bet you can write perfectly well on your own, and I’ll bet you can even write perfectly well in the first person. Be patient with yourself and just go ahead and do it.
I know how to write really well, actually – and I don’t need your condescending phony support to know this. The people here? Those who commented on the other post? Those are the people who lifted me up and helped me get there. You think you’ll ever mentor anyone? Who would want to go into any sort of dialogue with you? It would be like a horror movie unfolding to have any sort of conversation with you. I may have to sleep with a nightlight tonight just having this little interaction with you.
I had thought there might actually be a collaberation with you on this project. Unfortunately in attempting to get your attention early in the process, you chose to insist that I was picking on you and you decided to go very public in your own private arena, being the victim.
No you didn’t. You knew damn well you wouldn’t get hired. You chose that proposal to vent and rant about the injustices you see in the freelance world because you’re a writing snob. Someone wanted to pay for some content and then put their name on it (you ignored the fact that I did NOT ask you for an entire novel but simply a short start). I chose here to respond to you specifically Elance is NOT the correct place to take rants and arguments. You showed very poor character doing that. That’s a business exchange platform.
Since you did use the image of a “room full of rejection letters” (or words to that effect, I assume you know that the world is a tough place and we are never all things to all people. Your response to me was in your own little world where you control what you write, and what anyone else writes, too. You control the eraser on your own blackboard and if you don’t like someone else you can attack, reattack, and snipe, and most likely delete any comment you don’t care for, to your heart’s content.
I don’t have a room full of rejection letters. I also don’t see it as a badge of honor or a rite of passage like you do. It’s ironic that you think this is in my own little world. I put myself out there far more than you do, judging by what myself and the others found about you online. I share my successes, my failures, and my struggles so that they can help other people when they encounter an obstacle – like you – in their path. I don’t delete people’s comments that don’t agree with me – you could respond right here if you want to, but you won’t.
Perhaps it makes you feel good to do that. Empowered is the term, I guess.
I don’t need to feel empowered with a blog post. I feel empowered anyway.
But in the end it doesn’t get your fiction written either by you, or anyone else. Does it?
Sure doesn’t. But I already started writing my novel last night before you ever bid because I didn’t like what I was seeing in the bids. My goal in posting your idiotic comments was to show my loyal followers – who I help constantly – learn that there are complete assholes out there who think really highly of themselves but are nothing in the scheme of things – who will try to bring them down.
You are disgusting responding to anyone you don’t know like that online in a business proposal. If you had happened to post that to a fragile person, they may have given up. Wouldn’t you just be SO proud of yourself at that point? Oh the bragging you could do to colleagues, letting them know you prevented a world crisis by disarming a potentially creative writer.
I would still like to discuss your project with you. If you can have a conversation here, on THIS site, as a professional writer.
Roger M. Woodbury
Roger, there’s not one iota of professionalism in you. I promise you that.
Good luck – because with a mindset like yours, you will definitely need it.
Tiff
P.S. Thanks to my friend Vinnie for putting it so perfectly. Roger, this is you. Just a complete blowhard:
Share and Enjoy





Hi Tiff, good rant here
You know you’ve got the making of another great little book here don’t you?
This post could be the foreword and it’d draw people in like a power-magnet.
Would also be a brilliant wake-up call to every would-be out-sourcer.
Now Breeeeeeeeatheeeeee
Pete
lol Thanks Pete
Anchor me!
Acting like an asshole doesn’t show an atom of professionalism. And how insulting when he ask if you’re 13 and spending all time in facebook. Made me long to reach out of my monitor and slap him, LOL! If I were in your position, I would scream “it’s too late, man!”
Before I jumped to IM I was a fiction writer, I’ve had 20+ short stories and poetries published in magazines across my teenage years until early 20, but never made it to publishing house. If only I could have a dollar for every manuscript rejected! Roger said it as if it’s a writer’s disgrace, but depending on how you handle it, it’s not! From every rejection letter I received, the harder I learn, and my writing improved. so much that I able to win a fiction competition years later. And I thanked to those rejection letters for motivating me to keep learning.
The best mentor I found is a writers’ community, and we were coached by some national reputed fiction writers. It’s at zero cost, and no one laugh at your face when you are afraid. Afaik No professional writer would act like Roger, at least from what I’ve met personally.
My personal problem now is translating those stories to English for Kindle. this is biggie, because the translation kills the style and metaphor powers, which I play a lot on. I even abandoned them. Your current posts about jumping to fiction is actually like a wake up call for me, a reminder to a realm I’ve left long time ago. If you’re willing to jump such a hoop for fiction, yes I can too.
Tiff, you might want to check the fiction writing guide book titled “Hooked”. It’s a damn good one!
Glad it inspired you to get cracking – especially if you have all that under your belt!
“I well understand how you must be frightened after reading the volumes of comments on your blog. If writing were as easy as blogging zippy one liners I doubt you would have posted a request for proposal at all.”
ROFLMAO…
In your original post I actually gave the guy some credit, thinking that he didn’t realize how pompous he was sounding, and thinking maybe he was trying to be cute or funny so his response would stand out.
I think it’s pretty obvious that (1) he really doesn’t understand anything outside of his narrow “reality” – the TV show in his mind where he reigns supreme, and (2) that even if he did write something for you it would be obtuse and stilted.
His “style” is so formal and reserved – definitely a far cry from your easy to read and easy to understand approach.
“You know, your blog comments show you know how to write in at least the chatroom. I’ll bet you can write perfectly well on your own, and I’ll bet you can even write perfectly well in the first person.”
I have to say that this time his sarcasm is just way too obvious. He must have a lot of pain.
And it’s really too bad that you are not a professional writer – you could certainly be making a boatload of money if you could only write as well as he does (instead of blogging in your zippy chatroom)!!
Many professor types are stuffy like that – except the good ones you get once in a blue moon. I’ll keep my zippy chatroom style any day compared to his. lol
Which, of course is only PART of why we love you, Tiff! Rock on!
Thanks Katie
Hey Tiff, when are you going to start blogging zippy one liners? I think I’ve missed them….?
soon! lol
Yea that video nailed who this guy really is: an intellectual who thinks he is better/smarter/cleverer than everyone else. Just like most professors in todays colleges. Few of them have real world experience and they really have little clue about how the real world works.
They do a lot of speculating/posturing/lecturing but in the end say nothing of value. Of course if he were a real writer himself (and not just a wannabe) he would be writing his own books and not wasting time on Elance for pennies.
We agree, Jim! (Did a pig just fly past my window/)
Hehe. It’s like he thinks he lives in a book and can be one of those stereotypical mentor characters who is so mean and crusty, but at the end of the story, changes the mentoree’s life. But the fact that he will take work for $10 a page (did I read that correctly?) and his inability to understand the person he is talking to shows he doesn’t have much to offer except abuse.
lol Yes it is Alice. I think he was being a smart ass with the $10/page but he couldn’t pay ME $10 a page to let him write for me.
Ah, I think I was missing some of the context of the discussion. But somehow, he was entertaining it since he was responding. For the record, I don’t hold it against any writer for taking $10 per page, but if you take a holier than though attitude along with the low pay, something just doesn’t add up.
Ummm, Roger dear, second paragraph..”focused” and not “focussed”…Just saying!!! Just saying…::)
You can’t get him on that one. Focussed is also correct, just not used in American English.
Perfect. Have known so many people like Roger in my lifetime. One that comes to mind is a guy who was hired for much more than I was making to “test” manuals that we wrote. He had a Phd, a beard and a very condescending manner. Unless we wrote in manual, “…and press ENTER,” he was clueless and just sat staring at the screen expecting something to happen and not having the common sense to “press ENTER.” LOL.
Oops…sorry…was logged in on Tiff’s blog…This is her MOM speaking.
LOL
Well, Hi Beverly!! ::)
LOL This IS Tiffany – I just went and looked and now I’m all confused. I had my Mom log in for me yesterday while I was driving. Hi Mom!
Ha ha ha!
Halfway through I was thinking, “Is this Tiff? I doesn’t read Tiff!”.
I’m dying here!
Beverly-
You look so much younger today-lol! What’s your secret? Get some more content on your cast iron cooking site. I love it!
Take care!
Cindi
I keep telling her that!
Mom that’s classic. I love it. I don’t get where the brain misfires for these people and they become as dumb as a rock.
All this crap about “sweating blood and tears” in writing is really just all about the writer’s ego. It’s not “proper” writing. But guess what? It’s what people love to read! If you can write what people love to read, then surely that’s what matters most? Leave the tortured tomes to the purists…and write for the people and not necessarily your own ego.
I am now Carole
I am.
I always liked Rodney Dangerfield. He was so funny. Look, Tiff, I wouldn’t let this guy get to you. Up to recently, I only wrote nonfiction for clients. I decided to take on a fiction book for a client. He read the first draft and loved it. I’m doing a rewrite now. I have to admit I’m scared and nervous about doing fiction. The last time I wrote any kind of story was back in the 70′s. But I wanted to do it because if I did the work well, I would get another job from it.
Tiff, you and I are alike in many ways, and it is refreshing to know you are there in Texas. If I were there in front of you, I’d give you a big hug. You deserve it.
My mother always told me to do what my heart compelled me to do and not let anyone stop you. Don’t let what this creep said bother you to the point you don’t accomplish what you set out to do.
Take care.
Harry
Oh it’s not at all
I want others to see it and learn from it. Know that if they encounter a Roger type, recognize they’re blowhards and not worthy of any tears.
I agree. It is better that people learn about these blowhards and a****holes so they will stay away from them. I know I wish I knew about these types when I first started. Could have saved me a lot of anguish. It’s never to late to learn.
Kudos to you and a big hip hip hurray as well.
Take care.
I’ve heard many times that people were grateful for knowing this happened to others so they didn’t think it was just them.
Haha, maybe he should rather concentrate on improving himself instead of trying to knock down others. And writing: “Truthfully, don’t you think outsourcing creativity and than laying claim to authorship is, well, something else again?”
THAN laying claim?
It’s not that difficult to know the difference between ‘then’ and ‘than’. Even people with English as their second language, like me, know the difference.
Nab
I noticed that too but I was trying not to distract myself from his vile attitude lol
I think this is a really good lesson for all of us. I know one area I struggled with when I started to build my online presence was putting myself “out there” for the world — you are vulnerable once you do that, and snobs are at the tame end of what is out there in the viper pit (as you well know, Tiff!).
So thanks for sharing your experience about this – we definitely need to see the bad as well as the good.
I agree Mary! One subscriber her just unsubscribed saying I should have handled it differently in private. Why? It’s not like he was there to have a true dialogue, and i would never in a million years hire him – so using him as an example of how you might encounter someone is PERFECT!
I find this response to be as breathtaking as yesterday Tiff.
Notice how he dismisses blogging as zippy little one liners?
No Roger that’s twitter! And stop digging yourself even deeper eh?
Yep! LOL
Wooowww. What a hypocrite. It sounds to me like he’s telling you things he’s not even doing. Although, I’ve had issues with bullies my whole life and I will say it makes me feel better to know I’m not the only one. The fact that a bully online will go after someone of your caliber (you’re awesome) means a bully can attempt to victimize anyone. Believe it or not, that’s helpful to know cause I thought it was just me. Your oh-so-true replies to him cracked me up. Thanks for standing up to him, it shows me what is possible. You go girl!
Agree Katie! That’s why I show it. It empowers more fragile people somewhat.
Roger needs to go to AAA, Arrogant A**holes Anonymous, jmho.
lol he’d never be anonymous though. Not someone of his caliber.
I’ve never seen a man more doomed to failure or crippled by his own lack of literary success in my life.
I’d say he’s a barrel of laughs to go for a few beers with. A hoot.
I actually feel sorry for him to be honest – he’s brought bitterness and resentment to a whole new level.
Sad really
I do too – I mentioned on Google Plus that I didn’t know whether to be disgusted or pity the poor fool.
As Mr. T would say, “Pity the fool!”
What a sad individual. His world is one I definitely would not want to be a part of. It seems no matter what is said to him, he will never admit a mistake or say “I’m sorry.” Some people will always point any errors to everyone but themselves. Wish him well and continue doing the good work you do for the rest of us. He’s what I call an emotional vampire…sucking our positive energy for his own insatiable ego stroking.
Rock on Tiff…
Amen Sydney!
When I read your response I could almost hear Cloe Agnew singing “You Raise Me Up”. (Well worth a search on You Tube) I used to work with a guy like that. He wrote all his stuff on an old manual typewriter because he thought writers were supposed to suffer. Last I heard of him he was selling Toyotas and complaining that the world never understood his literary genius.
lol I know so many of those.
Love to compare the incomes of collaborative writers like Patterson, J J Abrams, Oh and most of the politicians, public speakers and singers in the top 100 at the moment…. with the puritanical views of some ‘traditionalists’.
Most successful writing is outsourced, including lyrics, poetry, screen, fiction and non-fiction – the successful ones are the result of outsourced idea’s, inspiration and mechanics.
Anyone who thinks they can create a product by living in their own vacuum is living in a dreamworld and rolling the dice that they become the next Stephen King or JK Rowling.
Buy a lottery ticket, it’s easier and less heartbreaking.
Rach
Agree Rach but I’m letting everyone take their own path – just glad I now know there’s not just one hard path.
Tiff this guy is such an arrogant pratt. He’s so arrogant he can’t even recognise it himself nor how incredibly condescending his reply is! And for somebody who has only made $738 and has all of his projects still outstanding on Odesk I am not really sure why he would be looking for more work – why doesn’t he finish the ones that he has. Oh that’s right, it’s probably those naughty employers who are not getting back to him – oh gee I wonder why because you would think from February and April they may have managed a few minutes to get back to him!
Pesky employers. Don’t they know he’s important enough to listen to?
Ya know Tiff, sometimes this blog is so seriously funny that I can’t believe it.
You are way cool! I’ve met so many people like Roger! Mostly offline up till now. There’s no need to be rude as he is. But this particular blog is really fun to read. I think all of us, your “blog followers”, must be a group of renegades from reading the entries.
Well, whatever, we all love you!
Isn’t it great to live in the real world?
We are renegades. Read John Locke’s book about how he sold 1 million books. You guys are the “cool people.”
You go, girl!
I will Linda
Well Tiff – have you appointed yourself “Guardian of the Net” where you feel you have to spend your time attacking people you don’t like?
You lower your own standards using comments like
“I’d much rather be young at heart and full of possibilities than a shrivel-hearted, bitter man like you”
WOW – how judgmental can you get????
He ‘attacks’ you so you ‘attack’ back – just like kids in the schoolground.
Just ignore people like that so you don’t give them more mileage/more profile
Hey John! I don’t know you but let me ‘splain to you how it works here with me. I am not “Guardian of the Net” – but I emailed MY subscribers of MY blog to let them know about certain situations they might encounter – ESPECIALLY since many of them are pursuing the same course as I am which gave advice to outsourcing the content which this loudmouth hated.
Now…I will spend my time doing any freaking thing I damn well please. I’ve earned that right. I didn’t go out and find Mr. Woodbury to “attack” as you seem to imply. This asshole came to MY project and started an argument with ME. I don’t think you ought to speak to me about what MY standards are. Because I think someone who isn’t shy about outing this kind of vile behavior is GREAT and I wish someone would have done that for ME back when I was new.
If you’d roll over and wimp out, that’s fine by me. I don’t. I also didn’t care about “working it out” with him. I wanted to use his behavior as an example to the people I DO care about – those readers whose comments you see on these two posts – the same fragile people who come to me via email anxious about things that go wrong, and this is the type of creep they might encounter.
So yeah I’ll expose them as examples and be judgmental about it. I don’t think this gives him “mileage” or “profile” – and read the comments. There are people there who acknowledged that his reply to them would have crushed them.
What I’m doing with this post?
It’s a preventative measure in taking care of those whose back I need to have – and who have mine.
If you don’t like it, click away! Find someone whose standards you DO admire. I’m damn not sure not trying to be everything for everybody. No need.
Well, maybe he’s taking a road less traveled here. MOST people just stick to the job requirements, bid a price and leadtime.
HE, world class Elance writer, is taking a completely different approach here. Be rude, arrogant and completely insult your potential clients.
I didn’t say it was a good plan…just a different one!
What a j-e-r-k
Maybe he read one of those men’s dating guides where you insult the woman and get her to fall for you so he’s trying it out with work…lol
Or maybe he read “The Rich Jerk” and he’d like to brand himself “The Writing Jerk” lol.
It’s laughable how he continually tries to reframe the whole thing to you being a close minded shrew. But his patronizing is awesome. I think he could be an entertaining judge on American Idol!
Maybe but he’s not as witty as Simon is.
Yeah Tiff, I’m gonna go street. You know me well and know sometimes I do (or have to). Easiest description of Roger Buriedwood: “Punk Ass Biotch”, pure and simple. And Roger, I hope you read it.
lol He won’t – he’s above all this nonsense.
Hi Tiff,
My writing mentor once told me that I would have to fight people telling me to put my pen down and give up the idea of being able to write a creative paragraph.
While this has been true (there’s always someone in the family who believes I’m wasting my time on the Internet and should get a REAL job) – I never let them get me down.
In fact, these type of people make me work harder at my Internet business to prove to them just how wrong they really are about me!
So to Roger and people like him – go blow your self-righteous horn in the corner because the tune you’re playing isn’t my kind of music!
Tiffany – you rock in my book, girlfriend!
- Bonnie
Bonnie don’t ever let anyone put out your light!
Hey Tiffany, thank you so much for sharing this with us. If anything, this douche bag woodberry guy has inspired me more to actually pursue creative writing than the opposite of what his original intention was.